Transcript from the final edit. Made with speech-to-text; it may contain errors. Guest views and accounts are their own.
[0:00] I wanted to end my life. I was isolated. I was in such a broken place that I was in the literal pit of hell. I grew up with the understanding that if I was gonna get out of this, um, cycle of poverty, that I would need to work very, very hard, and I wanted to be successful because then I would be valuable, and I needed to look perfect on the outside if I was gonna be worthy of, uh, being loved. I had failed at this point in university.
[0:30] I had failed, um, being a mother. I'd failed at my marriage. Uh, everybody in my life at this point had left me, and, uh, now that I've sinned and I've relapsed, uh, surely Jesus is gonna leave me, too. And, uh, I concluded, uh, in my heart, like with all of my heart, that, uh, nobody had ever loved me. And, uh, that is the one of the most painful things to experience. Uh, the utter despair.
[1:02] It's like somebody took an anchor, tied me to it, and threw me in the ocean to the very bottom. Like, that's how what came over me. And then I said to, to, to God, I, I called out to Him. I said, "God, have you been here all along?" I was really upset. And in that moment, the presence, the overflowing presence and love of Jesus flooded every area of my being, my mind, my heart, the environment, and I knew that I was encountering the love that never fails.
[1:37] It's Jesus. Karin, welcome to the podcast. We've worked together for well over two years, and, uh, I know most of our chats have been about work. Uh, I do know God has done a mighty work in your life, and I'm really excited to hear your, your story. So where does that story begin? Yeah. L- let me begin with my upbringing. Uh, my dad, he met my mother i- in a strip club, so she was a, a stripper, and he'd taken a liking to her. And, uh, they tried to … They got married, so they, they tried to establish a, you know, a normal, a relationship.
[2:14] Uh, but my mother, she came from a lot of brokenness herself, so she was in the foster system her whole life. Um, she went through a lot of abuse, um- From her foster fathers and relationships that she had been in before she met my dad, and, uh, through sexual abuse. And, uh, she spent some time in the psychiatric ward as well. So I was born into them trying to have a normal relationship, but it was extremely toxic.
[2:47] And I… What I witnessed, uh, when I was, you know, a small girl, uh, as a family unit, you know, a husband and a wife, and, uh, being a mother or being, you know, um, in a family, that was very corrupt. Uh, it was a very toxic relationship, and I was exposed to a lot of the abuse and, a, a lot of the, the sexual abuse as well, and I took part in that as a young girl. Uh, nothing that, um, a little girl, you know, at the age of, like, four would need to go through, and it wasn't in the design of God.
[3:24] So, uh, at the age of four, my mother, I remember like it was yesterday, very vividly, and I've always had this memory. But, uh, uh, she sat, uh, my brother and I down on the stairs, and my brother was two at the time, so he, uh, was crying profusely. He was a toddler. And I remember my mother sitting on the stairs, and I was standing in front of her, and she has said that she was going to leave and, uh, that, uh, she promised that she would come back.
[3:54] But I remember at the time that, uh, she wasn't gonna come back. I knew at that age already. I don't know how, but I carried this with me knowing that she wasn't gonna come back. And so after that, my dad, he was declared unfit to be a, a father. And to be honest, it wasn't, you know, in his priorities. It wasn't something that he was willing to take on. And, uh, so we were left to the system. Uh, but praise God for wonderful grandparents who, uh, came in and decided to adopt me.
[4:25] So sh- uh, they adopted me first. Uh, my grandpa was, uh, at the brink of retirement and, uh, yeah, then a year later they adopted my brother. And we lived an alright life for about a year, and then all of a sudden my grandfather, he lost everything, uh, just, uh, at the brink of retirement. Had some really, um, I guess bad, um, business, uh, investments, and, uh, we became very poor overnight I remember one Christmas, uh, we didn't have money for celebrating Christmas, and people in the community were so nice.
[5:01] They brought us food. And I used to love Barbie dolls, um, so they brought knitted little clothes for my Barbie dolls. And, uh, my grandfather, he would wake up every morning at 5:00 and pray, and his Bible was on his bed, and he would patch up my school clothes and, uh, make calls so that we can go to school for free. And they received money from the government, um, as grants to take care of us. But, uh, I grew up with the understanding that if I was gonna get out of this, um, cycle of poverty, that I would need to work very, very hard, and I would need to, you know, take life into my own hands to, to make it, uh, in the world.
[5:43] And so I became very ambitious and very driven, um, almost in an un- unhealthy… Well, it was an unhealthy way. Like, on the outside, I think being ambitious is good, but internally, I had masked this, um, need for love, and I tried to earn it through, uh, my achievements. So I put a lot of pressure that I needed to be better at everybody else if I was going to, you know, receive love or, um, I needed to do well in school.
[6:18] I needed to, uh, get A's if I was gonna get a scholarship. I got my first job since I was 15. I continued working from there, and I just, you know, became, wanted to be this independent person. But on the outside, uh, I'd built this facade of perfection, like I needed to look perfect on the outside if I was gonna be worthy of, uh, being loved And, and then on the other side of that, I resented my father.
[6:49] I resented him for abandoning me, and I resented him for abusing me. And I wanted to make it out there in the world and really tell him at the end of the day, "Look what I've done, and you had nothing to do with it." Um, and so that created a lot of, you know, um, resentment inside of me and, and a, and a unhealthy, um, fantasy world that I created of perfection that I could never attain to and nobody else ever could if they tried to, you know, be in a relationship with me.
[7:24] Um, and, uh, I mean, everything worked well. I was a straight A student. Um, I had planned my whole life out. I would go to university, get a scholarship. I would be in a relationship, and my plan was to become a journalist. Um, the idea of family and, uh, it being a mother or being a wife was, uh, corrupt to me and I never, uh, ever uttered the word mother. Uh, my grandmother was my grandmother. I never, um, thought that family was something to be attained to or admire or want.
[7:57] So I wanted to go to New York, live in an apartment, uh, looking at the view, independent, be in a relationship, but, um, not, you know, have a family. I wanted to be successful because then I would be valuable and I would, you know, be loved And, uh, so from that, everything went well. Went to university and, uh, in the first couple of months I started to get, um, these intense pains in my abdominal area.
[8:28] And, uh, sometimes it was so painful that I, I couldn't, um, I couldn't get up. I was bedridden. And I went to the doctor a couple of times, and eventually the doctor referred me to a gynecologist, and she did an ultrasound on my uterus and my, uh, my abdominal area, and she then, uh, told me that I've got endometriosis. And, um, at the time I didn't really understand it. Um, she gave me some pills and she told me that, you know, if the pain gets worse, uh, we would, uh, need to, you know, go through an operation.
[9:02] Uh, there were cysts on my ovaries and, and so I lived like this for a while, and then I came back, got some stronger pills. She put me on pills that I needed to take every day that removed my cycle completely for almost two years, and she told me a couple of times, she would say to me, "You can never have tr- I don't think you can have kids. Like, it's really unlikely, you know, um, that this, that this is for, that you're gonna have children." And so, I mean, I wasn't interested in having kids anyway, so that just solidified my plan for the future.
[9:34] And, uh, in my final year of university, I remember my grandma was looking at me. She was looking at my arms 'cause I was picking up weight and I was very sick. I was throwing up profusely. And she said, "Carina, I think you're pregnant." And then I was like, "I, I mean, that's not possible, you know. Um, I haven't even had any cycles." But I, I went to, uh, take a test, came out positive. Uh, I went to, uh, an obstetrician, um, and, uh, right there did the ultrasound.
[10:05] Three and a half months, you're having a boy. And, uh, in that moment, I remember years prior, I must have been in first year of university, I had just a flash dream of a little boy on my hip, and this boy's name was David. So I was like, "Hey, you're David." But internally, I was absolutely appalled at the idea of being a mother. Like, it, it, it was horrific to me. I, uh, I didn't want to… I didn't think that I could be a mother.
[10:39] Uh, I didn't want to be a mother. It actually, it, it was horrific to me. And also the, the outward perfection that I tried to build, um, it came crumbling down at this very public display. Because I'd been to church up until that point, and, uh, we know that it's a sin, right? Um, to, to… You're, you're in final year of university. Now you're falling pregnant. And so I tried to cover that one up, too.
[11:09] And what is the, the, the, the moral decision when you, when you are pregnant, is to, to get married. So within six months of having my son, David, I got married. I walked down the aisle. Uh, I remember that night I was very tired from setting everything up, and I found out that my husband had spent the night before in a, in a private room with a stripper And I know these things happen, but it was almost like, um, all of the pain and all of the things that I'd try to suppress, and my mother wasn't alive at this time anymore.
[11:50] I'd found out that she passed away. So, uh, all of that pain from a stripper and them being home wreckers, like, it all came crashing in at that moment. And I found out, um, a little bit later that before I'd gotten married and afterwards that my husband, um, before that he had also, um, he had, uh, done some sexual activities, experimented with his male friends. So this whole facade of, like, having a perfect relationship, which I completely idolized, like, this relationship was everything to me.
[12:28] It was, uh, this person that loves me and, you know, me being valuable. And, uh, so that all came crumbling down and, uh, it was just so much for me to handle. I felt completely broken. Uh, but to re- to be honest as well, like, me as a person during that time, I was a horrific person. Like, I was very selfish. In my mind, if I have to examine my thought process then versus now, like, then everything was around, you know, my life, um, my success, you know, wanting to receive love and be accepted and, and, uh, to attain all of these things.
[13:13] And I'd created, like I said, this fantasy life of perfection. And so I wasn't a good, an easy person to be with. I was very difficult. Um, and I used to believe that I was too difficult to, to love, and I would go on destructive missions anyway to push people away, um, and prove that, that lie that I kept repeating in, in my mind. So, uh, I was a, a, I was a horrible person, uh, to be with, and all of this took place.
[13:43] And so after this, I went on a real destructive war path to destroy myself completely and to destroy, uh, everybody else around me as much as I could. And I, I got invited to go to a bar. I went to the bar, started drinking that night. I was… Uh, I took, uh, my very first, I would say, ex- proper, like, drug. Uh, and that was speed mixed with MD. So that took me on a mission.
[14:13] I started going to bars more often. That went to trans parties, experimenting with drugs. I thought I would go to trans parties away from This, the, this problem of a life that, uh, was a mess, and thought I could, you know, relive my s- become somebody else and find freedom at these trans parties. You know, you're dancing, you're far, and I'm dancing somewhere. But, um, deep inside I was empty. I was very empty, and I was very broken.
[14:44] And, um, I got into abusive relationships then. Um, I got into two abusive relationships. Uh, the second abus- abusive relationship, uh, nearly killed me, and I will speak a little bit more about that one. So, um, yeah, I- Can I just clarify? At this time … Yes. Sorry, I'll just clarify that this is in South Africa. You know, you grew up in South Africa, right? And all of this happened in the country of South Africa, in Cape Town.
[15:16] Correct. Yes. Thank you, yeah. Yeah. So, uh, a couple of years prior, my aunt, you know, we're very close, and, um, the Lord saved her when she was 10, but she went through her own journey. But, uh, uh, we did not have a good relationship because I was very rebellious. Um, when, uh, I didn't share this, but, like, at the age of 15, that's when I got into this relationship with the person that I married and, um, I became Super rebellious, like the gothic hair, the black nails, skulls.
[15:54] My boyfriend at the time was listening to Cradle of False, Willard For My Valentine, like really, really demonic music, you know. Cradle of False, like Cradle of False. And I, um, so I went down r- that path, and she came to me and she said to me, "Karin, the Lord shared with me years prior that, um, a man would walk into your life and, and he would curse you, and it would be a very hard road." And, uh, like always, I didn't, you know, think too much of it. And she always came with a gavel, and I hated any form of authority telling me what to do because I was in control.
[16:33] Um, and, uh, I just wanted to not listen to any type of discipline or authority. And, uh, so I met this young man, and, uh, the upside down cross on his neck should have given it away. But I really think, you know, I wanted destruction, and this was the perfect idea of destruction, uh, in hindsight. And so we got into a relationship. For the sake of this podcast, I'm gonna call him John, if that's okay. So I got into a relationship with John. He seemed like a troubled y- you know, young man.
[17:05] But, um, after a while, you know, in the beginning of our relationship, first couple of months, I mean, he said everything that I wanted to hear. Um, I remember him saying something like, "You, you, you want security. You want somebody to make you feel secure," and all of those things. Uh, and I, uh, was with him, and then after a couple of months I, uh, realized that he was a meth addict And in the beginning, I had done the drugs with him a couple of times, but it seemed like, hey, it's like the other drugs.
[17:39] We do it sometimes when we out. Um, but at this point, it, it, he was an, he was an addict, and I became… The time that I spent with him, I started doing it with him as well. And, uh, he was, uh, going to court at the time for possession. So I realized this is, this is, this is an addiction, like, he's… This is his thing. Um, and, uh, yeah, the, the relationship, uh, escalated to s- a b- like, a hectic abuse.
[18:10] He- it started with him breaking down my character. Um, after a while, uh, I bec- got isolated from my friends. So my friends weren't, uh, good for me. I, I had to cut them off, and eventually my family. And, you know, things would happen. Like, he would say to me, "They are not good for you. They are against our relationship," and X, Y, and Z. And then n- the next moment, I would see that manifest and say, "Oh, John's right. This did happen, and I need to block them." And eventually, I'd lost my friends, isolated from my family, and then I, uh, lost the place that I lived in.
[18:47] And, uh, uh, his family, his family, uh, invited us to come live with, with him. And, uh, on the outside, his family looked very nice, like, the perfect idea. And in, in my heart, to be really honest, I had rejected my family, and I was potentially looking for a, a family that I think, you know, should look a certain way. And so on the outside, they had a nice house. The husband and wife loved each other.
[19:18] If you walk in, like, it's this beautiful pictures on the wall. They were so welcoming, so caring, so understanding, so supportive. And so they converted their garage into a unit for us to live in, and we lived there. And, uh, that's when things became really demonic and really abusive. How old were you at this point? So this was in 2018. Um, 23, 24. Yeah. So this was after university, after you had your son.
[19:51] Correct, yes. I dropped out of university in my final year, pregnancy. And, uh, yeah, got married. And then after that, um, spiraled and met this young man. Understood. So you met when you were 15. Yeah. So- Left university, and then obviously you found out he was addicted to, uh, meth, which is, uh, ice in America, I think it's called, or in Australia. Um And methamphetamine, right?
[20:22] Sure. So different people. The person that I married was my high school sweetheart. Mm-hmm. Uh, I, and, uh, I married him, found out about his, his things, his hobbies, and, um… But this person is a different person. So John- Okay. Okay. Got it … is a different person. Mm-hmm. Okay. So- Yeah … makes sense. Thank you for, thank you for clarifying. So you were saying it got really demonic once you moved in with the family? So, uh, as I moved in with the family, I found out that he, his father, the family on his father's side are Freemasons.
[20:59] Uh, and they just opened up and, and shared about it. Uh, it was in the house and everything as well. And his grandmother came on the father's side, and she's a full, she was a full witch. Um, she's a fortune teller and a, a… She called herself a witch, and I saw her do witchcraft right in front of me. And, uh, John's mother also would consistently see fortune tellers. Um, John himself, um, was a warlock and a Satanist, uh, as well. Did a witchcraft.
[21:30] It escalated. It got… It escalated, um, consistently. Like, I saw him change to a completely possessed person in front of me. Um- Uh, I'll share some, some things that I experienced. So I, I started seeing demons all the time. And, uh, it wasn't like I was just seeing them. They acknowledged it. So they, they, they put things in the house. It, it was almost like the h- the house belonged to the demons. They had, uh, committed the house.
[22:02] Like, the… It was the demons' territory, and they would speak about the demons like, "He this," and, uh, uh, "Oh, yes, uh, I see, I see him. He's been here for a while." Like, "This is, this is…" You know, they would speak like that. One morning, uh, he has… He had a bit of a, a younger sister. She was a couple of years younger. Um, she woke up one morning and, uh, we would sit around this round table by the barbecue, like the braai area, where everybody would sort of, you know, have dinner, breakfast.
[22:32] So we sat at the breakfast table, and she had woken up, and she had, uh, scratch marks all over her arms. And she sat like that. And, uh, John and her were talking, and they were like, uh… She was like, "He came last night, and he's very angry, and we need to give him a sacrifice." And then John was like, "Don't worry. We're gonna sort it out." And I sat there thinking to myself, "Okay, this is really hectic. Like, what am I involved in here?" Um, that was one instance.
[23:04] Another instance, uh, not an instance, this was an ongoing thing, but, um, John started using my body to do rituals. And in the beginning of it, I questioned him about it. He said it, you know, it was for our relationship. It was for protection. And so, uh, often what I would just do, uh, the drugs and my body would be used, um, for rituals. Uh, John would take, uh, sticks or would take ash, and he started to create symbols around me, uh, which I now know one of the symbols was a symbol for death.
[23:35] Like, it's a spell of death that he was creating around me. Uh, he started to listen to Satanic music consistently and even create it, like sing it, rap it. Um, and this was an escalated period of time, like, where things just became more and more demonic. Uh, one evening, I woke up, uh, in my bed, and I saw this woman walk, uh, past my bed, at the edge of my bed. And, uh, I mean, she looked like she was a real woman, but, uh, she didn't look like she was there.
[24:08] She didn't look… I didn't believe in ghosts at the time. I grew up understanding, you know, praying in tongues. I grew up as my uncle prayed in tongues. I grew up, uh, I saw demons when I grew up as a child a couple of times, and teachers had to pray for me. So I did believe in demons. On the ghost side, I wasn't too sure. But, uh, I saw this woman, brown hair, tall, and then the next day, uh, on Facebook, a lady messaged me, and she started striking up a conversation, and I knew that she, uh, was into New Age.
[24:41] She was into crystals and tarot cards and things like that. And a couple days down the line, I, like, just came out and I said to her, "Look, you look like somebody that was in my room," you know? "That's really weird." Uh, thinking that she would think it was weird, and she said, "No, I'm, I'm glad you saw me. I tried to peek through. I'm glad, uh, it worked." Uh, and that's when I discovered that astral projection is real. It's really a thing, and people are literally doing it. Um, after that, during this time, like, the abuse continued, it-- physical, sexual, emotional.
[25:17] Um, I became very depressed. I became very su- suicidal, and, uh, I became very, uh, anxious. And, uh, through, through, uh, with time, I started to, uh, watch tarot card readings on YouTube. So this is when I started to really engage in New Age practices. So I'd watch tarot card readings on YouTube, and the lady… You know, everything that she shared is pretty accur- accurate. Like, it, it was, it was pretty accurate.
[25:47] And she would talk about how she speaks to her guardian angels and how she calls out to Arch Ang- Angel Michael or Gabriel. So I thought to myself, "That's great. You get a guardian angel, so I'm gonna try that." So I would look up at the sky, and I would, you know, try and speak to, uh, A- Angel, uh, Michael or Angel Gabriel to come and save me and help me. And, uh, I try to, um, watch YouTube videos on chakras, how to, how to release your chakras.
[26:24] Um, high-frequency music as well. You know, those megahertz, gigahertz sounds that you listen to for peace and prosperity. Uh, one day I was going to work, and I used to take bus to work, and I would walk, uh, about 10 minutes to work and take the same trip back home. And the day started with me seeing triple one, and I saw angel number- numbers the whole day till the end, till triple nine. Uh, after that, things really escalated and became extremely, extremely de- demonic.
[27:00] Let me just ask, because that also happened to me for quite a while. I know. Yeah … which was I was seeing these numbers, uh, show up and- I was praying for you … you know, in different place- I was like … in different places … "Come out in the name of Jesus." Yeah, I know. Yeah. Uh- But I was, I was going to, to war. Yeah. But, yeah. Well, thank you for your prayers. Yeah. I, um-- So that happened for, that happened for a while, and it was the numbers four four four, like, it was wild what was happening.
[27:32] I had- Yeah … for example, these numbers were showing up, and it was on a podcast video. This was at the height of it. There was, you know, there was four hundred and forty-four thousand views, four hundred and forty-four comments. Yeah. And I was like, this was, you know, kind of- Mm … after a few days of it happening, I was like, this has just gone beyond, um, you know… And obviously, that might be part of the reticular activating system where you're starting to recognize stuff. But also, there's something else going on there because it was just wild.
[28:02] Uh, and the same with- Mm … one one one. Um, and you know, these- Mm … the New Age says these are angel numbers, you know. And some, there's some, I don't know how accurate this is, but from my searches on trusty Google, uh, trusty Google, there was, you know, some Christian thought about it as well saying, "Yeah, it is your guardian angel," you know. But who really knows? Mm. It's not scriptural, put it that way. So one question I did have was about what it was like in the Freemasonry house that you stayed at. 'Cause I think everyone's quite… Obviously, it's very secretive and- Mm-hmm … I mean, it's becoming more and more less secretive because of people are coming out.
[28:38] What was it like in there in the household, and did you see… You know, what stood out to you through The fa- the father, the mother, and how it differed from your, you know, your upbringing. So, uh, it looked like the picture perfect family, Aaron. I'm gonna be honest with you. Um, they're very, very successful. Ro- Freemasonry runs among, um, the elites, right? Um, so Freemasonry, like its roots is in the, uh, wisdom of Solomon if you go and, and do research about it.
[29:17] So they use the word and the teachings of Solomon, um, to, to make sacrifices and to, to, as witchcraft has spells, you know, incantations to achieve wealth and status and power. But, um, they have to make a sacrifice and I believe that his mother, John's mother, almost died giving birth to her son. And, uh, she had a severe health conditions from having him. Like, her hair fell out.
[29:48] She was on so many pills. And I remember whenever she go- got drunk, she would profusely declare how much she hates him, how she hates her son. And I, and that's when I thought to myself, like, that is not normal. It's not normal for a mother to… She, she'll say, "I absolutely hate him." And I thought, "Okay, you're just a bit drunk." But then I kept happening. Like, she was this… That's how she felt about her son. And I, I believe, of course you need to make sacrifices, and it's often children that, that get sacrificed.
[30:21] Um, I… It's, it's runs in the family. It runs in the family. And the father, he was trying to just blow it off, you know. He, he was the one that wasn't practicing it compared to other people, but it, he was, uh, it was his father, it was his family. But, uh, uh, what I could tell is that he just wanted to have a good time. He wanted to sort of to ignore what's happening in his bloodline. And, uh, uh, all of the brokenness that came from that. Because his sister, John's sister as well, did a lot of witchcraft.
[30:54] She, um, mental health issues, a lot of pills, um, brokenness. So, uh, on the outside it looks really, really good. They'll, they'll host and have people over, have a good time. Uh, pictures. Um, uh, wealthy. But, uh, on the inside it's, uh, it's, it's a, a, a nest for the demonic. Yeah, and for death. Exactly, and it's, it's a reverse. I mean, when you think about the promise of it, these are the sacrifices.
[31:27] Obviously, you have to sell your soul- Mm … to the devil, essentially. And in return- Yeah … you will get material, uh, worldly, uh, things. But inside, spiritually, you're bankrupt and you're cursed, essentially. If you look at, and this was, you know- Yeah … from Derek, Derek Prince talked about this a lot, who was- Mm … you know, obviously one of the, the mighty men of God of the last century. He- Mm-hmm share how the children of people in the Freemasons and, you know, generationally they are often- Mm-hmm have birth defects, cripple, uh, crippled, and, you know, real- Yeah … severe afflictions mentally and physically.
[32:13] Um, and oftentimes they would, through questioning, just figure out, oh, your family was, you know, involved with the Freemason. Um, and- Hmm … I know there's a female version of that, which I forget the name of, but there's a, a, a female version of Freemasons. I for- I forgot the name of it now. But, um- Hmm … that would obviously, it would be a curse afflicted on the, the family of people practicing Freemasonry, 'cause it goes against- Hmm … um, God, essentially, and it's a, it's a curse which get placed on a family. And it's, from all accounts, quite- Yeah … hard to break off as well, from, from what I've learned, so.
[32:49] Yeah, because it's set up in systems. So it's, it's, uh, the wisdom of the wise. In James, it speaks about, uh, demonic wisdom. So there's wisdom that is from God, and then there's wisdom from Satan. And a lot of times, it, it looks like it's from God, because it's biblical, right? Um, the Book of Chronicles, um, Solomon's teachings on Proverbs, everything, it's biblical. But, um, Freemasons, it's the, those very teachings that they use to amass wealth and, um, it, it is demonic wisdom.
[33:23] So, so that is ingrained in systems, through the systems of the world are run by it. So, so yeah. But, uh, um, praise God that, um, Jesus Christ, um, has come to set, set his people free and, and, yeah. Amazing. So you was just sharing about the, you know, the, the situation of the household and what was happening, um, you know, in that relationship. So please, please continue.
[33:54] So at this time I was working, uh, for, for Amazon, and I'd been working for Amazon for almost four years. Uh, professionally things always just seemed to go well. Um, I got promoted every six months. I was working horrible hours, 7:00 o'clock at night till 6:00 in the morning. So my son at this time didn't live with me permanently. Uh, and, uh, I honestly, I, I wasn't, I wasn't a mother at all to him.
[34:25] Uh, and, uh, one morning I came home from work and I'd received a, a call, and this was, you know, 8:00 o'clock in the morning. And, uh, his school called me and, and said, "You know, you need to come to, to fetch your son and take him to the ER because there's been an accident." And so drove there. Uh, boiling hot water had fallen on his legs and part of his genitals. And so I rushed him to the ER and, uh, he had to get skin graft and surgery done.
[34:58] And, uh, I stayed in the hospital with him for a week, and during that time I became so aware that I was such a selfish and horrible person. And, and that if, uh, if there's somebody that deserved, you know, um- For me to live for it would be my son, you know, that I needed to become a mother. I needed to, to change. And so I, um, stayed with him in the hospital, and then when I got out, I quit my job.
[35:32] And, uh, for two weeks I had to nurse him. Uh, it was a very painful, uh, time, but I had to put ointment on him, and he would scream at night because of the pain of the ointment being put on his body. And, um, during this time, I think it, it's the first time… And that was all by the gra- the grace of God for, um, giving me a revelation of how selfish I was, um, to, to, to allow my son, you know, to, to allow myself and to allow my son to first be in each other's lives.
[36:06] Because at that point, when I was alone with him and he would just say, "Mommy," to me, it was too much for me to handle. I just felt so worthless, like, so, uh, unworthy to, to even be called mom, and I would try and retract from it and… But, uh, uh, I had to embrace him. You know, I had to take care of him and in that moment. And, and then, uh, the Lord just started to work and, um, uh, but the abuse was still there and the depression, the anxiety, the suicidal thoughts were still there.
[36:41] And, uh, I remember, uh, one evening I felt, uh, so depressed that I, I wanted to, uh… I couldn't find a reason to live, to, to be honest. I co- I couldn't… Uh, even though the Lord had started working in my son's life, I would get to this place where it's like, "I'm no good for him. He's better off without me. It's my fault. I can't do this. There's no reason for me to live." And, um, so I was on my bed, and since I was a young girl, I would write a lot.
[37:15] And, uh, the reason why I've, I did this, I've never shared that, so, um, but I, I… Sometimes it used to get really difficult for me to express myself or to talk, like, uh, the, the, a lot of it would be painful, painful for me to talk. And, uh, so then I'd write to express myself, and that was just a way, an outlet for me. And so on this day, I decided I'm gonna write to try and find a reason to live, so I'm just gonna write and write and write. And I got to around, like, page four And at the end I wrote three words, and it's, "Love never fails." And, uh, those three words, I'd carried it with me all my life, and the Lord must have planted it in my life when I was young.
[38:00] But, um, I never knew it was a Bible verse, but I carried it as a teenager. I typed it out, posted it on my wall. When I was 18, I came out of a bad exam in university in first year and, um, I went to the tattoo parlor and I said, "Hey, can you, um, give me 'love never fails' with a cross?" And, uh, so I got that done. And people would ask me, you know, "Why do you… You know, what's with these words, love never fails? What's the tattoo about?" And every time I would make up my own definition.
[38:32] Like, for instance, in the beginning, when you meet somebody and you think you love them, three months down the line, after five years, you know, that love sort of matures and you're like, "Now I love this person." So that's a love that never fails. And so this time when I wrote love never fails on that, um, page, uh, I changed the definition again, and I, and I looked at other people and I was like, "Okay, John. John can't love me the way that I want him to love me. It's… You know.
[39:02] Or my family, maybe they haven't been able to love me. But you know what? Maybe I can be that love that never fails. So I'm gonna take it upon myself. I'm gonna love and not fail. You know, I'm gonna love no matter what. Like love regardless of, you know, if there's abuse or regardless if it's, you know, not in the way that I, that I want it to be, but I'm just gonna love, and through that, I'm gonna make it through." Obviously, that's a re- recipe for disaster, because all of our love fails.
[39:33] And, uh, so the abuse continued. Um, the, uh, depression continued. And, uh, one evening My, my aunt, she found her way in, um, by befriending John or just getting some approval from him. And so we invited them for dinner one evening, and I, um, I was very broken, and I think my aunt knew. She knew, but she was very subtle. She didn't say anything. She was just there.
[40:03] And, uh, after dinner, we sat outside, and she started to, you know, dig into my heart a bit, and I was crying. And I said to her, "You know, I don't understand. Since I've been a little girl, whenever I go through a lot of things, like, why do I always go through it alone? Like, why am I… I s- I see other people. They have a community, or they're… You know, I've been there for other people, you know, comforting them, but for me, when I go through things, and it's always alone." And my aunt, she was so kind. She put her hand on my shoulder, and she said, "You know, it's because Jesus has been there with you, and through all.
[40:47] He's the one that wants to be there with you and go through things with you. And, and that's why." And I, I never thought that because I grew up in a Dutch Reformed church, so go sit in the church pew. You'd worship. Uh, I remember the pastor used to pray, and, uh, I used to fall asleep because the prayer was so long. And then he used to say these words at the end, and I knew that's my time to wake up. Like, that's literally just what church was to me. Uh, like, bless him.
[41:19] Praise, praise the Lord that he, that he prayed, that he was faithful. But, but I never knew that I could have a intimate relationship with Jesus. I, uh, it was religion up until that point. And, uh, so I never knew that I, you know, that Jesus might have been there with me. And so that night everybody left. It was really dark. I was sitting in the garage. Um, and I looked up to the sky In the dark. And then I said to, to, to God, I, I called out to him and I said, "God, have you been here all along?" I was really upset.
[41:55] Um, uh, the second time around I s- I cried out again. I said, "Lord, have you been there all along and I didn't know it?" And there was complete silence. But, um, that's when Romans, I believe it's 8, um, where it says, "All who call on the name of the Lord will be saved." So that's when my salvation journey began. How old was you at that point? I mean, that must have been less than a year later. Uh, so 2024, '23.
[42:26] Yeah. Understood. So 2019. So- Let's do years. Yeah, 2019. Sorry about that. Yeah. No, that's, that's, that's great. So it really helps me just, um, you know, timeline-wise understand. So yeah, you've… You're in a relationship with John. You know, you're having issues there, you know, with his background, his family, and just the, you know, all that stuff that's happening. And then, you know, you reach out to the Lord in, in desperation really, and, you know, this is the beginning.
[42:59] So 2019, so 23 years old. That's right. Wonderful. And, um, after that, uh, let me share with you. So yeah, after that, um, yeah, the, the abuse continued. Uh, depression, anxiety, those things continued. I remember my aunt, she gave me Psalm 91, and I took it and I wrote it and pasted it on the inside of our cupboards so that John wouldn't find it, and I would recite it.
[43:33] So that happened. Uh, one day we were sitting at that breakfast table again, or I was sitting there. I was sitting there with my laptop. Um, I was working. And I heard a voice, and the voice instructed me to look at John. And, uh, so I looked at John. John at the time, he was washing his car. And then the voice said to me, uh, "I know you want him to be a bit nicer to you. Uh, for the next 24 hours he's gonna be the nicest person ever, and I just wanna know that I can give you this." And, uh, so that next day, John was the nicest person ever.
[44:12] He was serving me. Um, he was apologetic. Uh, he was… A- and truly, I wanted him to be nice. I wanted the abuse to stop. And at the same table we were sitting, uh, again the next day, and I was sitting at the same spot and I looked at him and, uh, I realized at that moment that that voice that spoke to me, it was the voice of Satan. Because I've, when I grew, grew up in church, I knew about the temptation of Jesus.
[44:46] I knew what that looked like. But I had a deep, sinking revelation of good and evil. Because that good and evil is tangible, and that, uh, people have a choice. They have a choice to serve Satan. They have a choi- and they have a choice to serve Jesus. And that scared me. That scared me so much. Uh, I, I never… Like, that was a light bulb moment for me. And, and then I threw away, like, I was like, "Satan, I will never serve you. Jesus, I will serve you." And I started to pursue Jesus from that moment.
[45:23] I started listening to worship music. I started trying to read the Bible. Uh, I would spend time with Jesus at night, still in that house, still, uh, all of that demonic oppression which had escalated up until this point. Uh, one evening, things became really, uh, hectic in the house, and I found a way out, and I just started walking down the road. And I was walking, and walking, and walking, uh, late at night, out in the neighborhood.
[45:57] Um, and I heard a voice again And this time, what was happening is I was again going into that place like, my son, I'm a horrible mother, and that my son would be better off without me. And, and, uh, in that moment, I heard a voice, and the voice said, "Whatever you do, don't leave." And I knew what that voice meant, that it meant that whatever I do, I cannot leave my son. It doesn't matter what it looks like.
[46:28] And I thought it was my mom's voice because I realized my son is four. Here I am contemplating leaving my son, and I realized that my mom who went through the same thing, that she was breaking herself down, contemplating leaving us, which she did. And, uh, honestly, I, I forgave her, and I just… I had so much mercy for her. Um, and I'm so grateful that the Lord, he intercepted because that's a generational cycle.
[47:02] That was a generational cycle repeating itself, and the Lord intercepted it with that voice. And, uh, I had to stay. So I s- praise God for that. Absolutely incredible. Yeah. That's a, that's a beautiful, beautiful realization that, yeah, your mom went pro- went through the same thing. And, you know, all glo- all glory to God that you was able to forgive her and release that- Amen … and break that cycle, which is, yeah, only, only God could do that.
[47:33] Amen. Only God could allow- Yeah … that to be released and forgiven and, you know, that to be lifted off your life. Yeah. Amen. Amen. And, uh, so after that, uh, I guess it was a couple of days later, um, I was in a room with John and he was, um, screaming at me about what a horrible mother I was, um, and, uh, breaking me down and, uh, all the usual. But, uh, this time it was full on about, uh, me being a mother.
[48:07] And, uh, couple of years prior, it was Mother's Day and I'd happened to go and visit a church and, uh, I received this little picture frame. And on this picture frame was, uh, um, like a phrase. And during this altercation, uh, I… my eye caught the picture frame and I looked at the picture frame on my right and it says this. Uh, it says, "As a mother, my job is to take care of the possible and to trust God with the impossible," by Ruth Bell Graham.
[48:43] And, uh, in that moment, John's eyes fell on the picture frame too, and there was complete silence. And I realized that the Lord was right there in that room, um, and he stood up for me, you know. Um, but, uh, John, he walked to the, to the end of the room. He was hanging on this cupboard, looking at the wall. And, uh, couple of moments later, he turned around, and when he spoke, uh, it wasn't him speaking anymore.
[49:15] It was… Uh, it sounded like, uh, if I can picture it, like an, an ancient old man. Uh, and he pronounced two curses on me in that moment. And the first one, he said that he loved me. Um, let me just take some water. So he said that he loved me and that was the fallen angel speaking through him, but, uh, nobody else ever would, and I would be alone for the rest of my life. Uh, and then the second curse, he said that I would be a prostitute, uh, just like my mother, and any way that I would ever be prosperous or earn money or anything like that would be, uh, in a way that I would use my body or sell my body.
[49:59] And, uh, he left the room, and in that moment, Aaron, I felt a dagger go straight through my heart, fire in my body. It was so painful. I fell to the floor and I was screaming out. It felt like I was in literal hell. Like, hell hell. That's how, how painful it was. And I, I knew that was my aunt, which she had shared with me. And so, uh, from here on out, like, the depression, the, the absolute worthlessness and despair was just, um, uh, escalating within me.
[50:37] Um, and, uh, what I would do, uh, at the end of the house that I lived in at the time, there was this small little room And, uh, a bathroom, small little bathroom. It was only a shower and a toilet. And I would go to that end of the house, uh, and really just spend time with the Lord and, um, just to get away and, and talk to God and cry. Whatever I needed to do. And on this day, I'd been on my knees, and I was just calling out to God saying, "Lord, what's my purpose?
[51:11] Like, what's the purpose for all of this? Who am I? Um, talk to me." And, uh, I just heard a voice, and the voice said, "Look up." So I looked up, and I looked straight into a shower curtain. And, uh, uh, on the shower curtain, there were all these different flowers. And, uh, I looked straight up at a blue rose. Straight up blue rose. And I just made a joke. I said, "Oh, am I… Is this something that doesn't exist or am I something that doesn't exist? Because that doesn't exist." And I just carried on. Um, and a couple of nights later, I… Up until this point, the day that I decided to pursue Jesus, um, was the day that I just… I knew, "Okay, I can't do drugs anymore.
[51:56] I can't use my body for these rituals and things." And I needed to, you know, try and live, uh, uh, a sinless life, you know, if I was gonna pursue the Lord, if I was gonna, you know, be a Christian. And I had relapsed. So I relapsed, and, uh, I felt extremely guilty, guilty about it. And I was in this hammock at night. I would spend time with the Lord at nights. And, uh, I was reflecting on my life. And what I ha- was reflecting on was for how much of a failure I was.
[52:30] I had failed at this point in university. I had failed, um, being a mother. I'd failed at my marriage. Uh, everybody in my life at this point had left me. And, uh, now that I've sinned and I've relapsed, uh, surely Jesus is gonna leave me, too. And, uh, I concluded, uh, in my heart, like with all of my heart, that, uh, nobody had ever loved me. And, uh, that is the, I would say, the most painful, one of the most painful things to experience.
[53:05] Uh, the utter despair. It's like somebody took an anchor, tied me to it, and threw me in the ocean to the very bottom. Like, that's how… what came over me. And, uh, I wanted to end my life. And, uh, but a couple of moments later, um, the Lord didn't leave me like that for long. Praise God. But, um, Jesus, uh, a song began to play on my phone. And, uh, this, the song is called Conversations in the Dark.
[53:40] Very fitting because even today still I spend time with the Lord in the dark. And the song was beautiful. The lyrics was just about, um, let's say it's a man who loves a woman and, um, he, he says, talks about her flaws. Yes, he acknowledges that she's acknowledging her flaws, but he says that he loves her and if, and if she would just be with him that, um, he would never break her heart. And in that moment when I looked down at the phone, it was the very shower curtain I saw two nights before.
[54:13] The blue rose was right there. Like, it looks like a shower curtain. And in that moment the presence, the overflowing presence and love of Jesus flooded every area of my being, my mind, my heart, the environment, and I knew that I was in the presence of Jesus. Like, this is Jesus And I knew that I was encountering the love that never fails. It's Jesus. Because in that moment I had relapsed.
[54:45] I'd been chasing my idols. I had been, um, in New Age. I had failed at everything. So everything that I thought I could, you know, cling to, to, to feel worthy of being loved, all of that had disintegrated and I, I looked like a literal corpse too. So in that moment of utter despair, utter brokenness, He poured His love over me and He didn't see me the way I was.
[55:17] You know, He s- He, He saw me and loved me the way that He created me. And I always remember that now. You know, whenever things have taken place, like look where the Lord loved you. You know? That unfailing love can go to that depth, uh, and, and bring… In, uh, Psalm 18 it says, "His love broke open the way and He led me out into a broad and open place." And so I was transformed in that moment. I was transformed. Like, uh, Psalm 18 says, "With you I can scale a mountain. You make my feet like the feet of a deer." So I was filled with, um… His love gave me strength and, and gave me the energy and the determination and the hope that I was gonna make it through.
[56:01] I was gonna make it out of, out of that place. And, and so, um, yeah, the abuse continued, but His love was like a shield. I, I can't explain it to you, but it was like whatever arrows were pointed at me afterwards, I could handle it. It was like, it was, it was fine. Jesus loves me. I met the one whose love never fails. I can, I can, I can handle anything. But I was still stuck in that house and I needed to, to leave and, and so, uh, yeah, I was praying for a way out.
[56:36] And what had happened is John sold his car for cash and like a cheaper car, and he blew the money and decided that, uh, he didn't want that small car anymore, that he just wanted money from the owner. So I decided, uh, you know, that I was gonna, um, contact the owner and I was gonna use that as my getaway car. So I contact the, the owner. Let's say his name's Mike. I said, "Mike, uh, look, I'm in an abusive relationship. Um, can I buy the car from you for, you know, I'll give you, uh, a portion now and then I'll pay it off over installments and then, uh, can I, can I leave with the car?"
[57:18] And so he said, "Yes, no problem. I won't tell anything." So the next morning I took my laptop. My son was there at the time. I looked him in the eyes and I said, "We're gonna get out of here." So I snuck, um I went to where the keys and the remotes are. There were sets and sets of keys and remotes. I grabbed a couple, went to the car, sat in the car, and I started pressing. And eventually the gate opened and I reversed out as fast as I could, threw remotes over the gate, and I began to drive.
[57:51] And I would drive, and we'd drive, and we'd drive for hours and hours and hours north, like mountains. And then eventually a policeman stopped me and said, "Ma'am, do you know you're driving all zigzag? Like, where are you going?" And so I told him what took place and he said, "Okay, just turn around and go back to family." So I went to my aunt's and my uncle and, uh, at the time we'd agreed a separation between me and my son, and, uh, I was gonna go into hiding.
[58:22] So I went to this community which is further off. Um, at this point I lost everything, so I didn't have clothes or makeup. Uh, I just had a laptop and, uh, that- that's pretty much it. And so the community helped me out. I stayed under tables for a bit on, on mattresses and, um, they, they were very kind. And then eventually the Lord took me completely off-grid. I found like a little cabin in the woods type of, type of, um, place. Uh, and there was no electricity, there was, there was no water.
[58:54] Um, and lived like that for a couple of months. But during this time had a Bible. I was seeking God. I was just so thankful that Jesus loves me. I didn't care about anything, you know, in terms of what I just lost. I, I gained the whole world. I gained Jesus. I met the one who loves me. Like the Samaritan woman at the well who comes to the well, you know, empty again, and she encounters Jesus. And, uh, she met the man who told her everything she had ever done, and she was just declaring his, his name.
[59:30] And, um, yeah, but after that, the Lord blessed me with a, a little one bedroom close to the beach in the area that I stay now. And, um, I got reunited with my son, and, uh, we began our lives. Yeah. And I used to go to the beach every day, spend time with the Lord, and God started that healing process, uh, in my heart. Uh, yeah, and I… We joined the, the local church. I got baptized and, uh, couple of weeks later, God, uh, filled with the spirit, baptism of fire, uh, praying in tongues, and I was, like, so zealous for Jesus.
[1:00:10] I was so in love with the Lord, and I didn't care, you know, what I did for God. But as long as the life that I live now, um, I live Uh, in Jesus, and I live for Him. And I used to declare Romans 12:1 every single day, because up until that point, I had used my body for evil. I had served Satan and, uh, so I declared, "I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God," uh, "submit your bodies as a living sacrifice, holy and pleasing to God, for that's your proper worship." So I committed my body unto the Lord every single day, and I, I wanted to be used, uh, for His glory.
[1:00:52] Um, and, uh, so I started serving in the church and the prayer team and everything was, was going well, um, once again, on the outside. Uh, internally, I was very, very oppressed. So, um, a couple of things. I was very poor. Um, I had to rely upon God every single day for food and for to survive, and I praise God for that.
[1:01:23] But, uh, just like the Israelites had to rely on, um, manna every single day. I remember the one day I didn't know how I was gonna get home from work. Uh, I didn't know how David and I were gonna have dinner. And literally, uh, moments before the end of work, I got a phone call, and somebody who had owed me money in the past sent me 50 rand. And 50 rand, I was able to buy literally chicken and get home. And the next day, but the Lord provided every s- every single day, and so that was a, a season.
[1:01:54] Um, and then, uh, other than that, I struggled from so much anxiety. It was very bad. Like, especially when I spoke to people of authority or to men, um, I would begin to stutter very, very badly. I could not communicate, and sometimes people thought it was like a disability or something, and so I just didn't talk. Um, uh, I felt like there was so much pain in my chest, like I couldn't, uh, breathe. Um, the depression, uh, I would dip into modes of depression and, and, and suicidal tendencies.
[1:02:31] Uh, in my sleep, I would have sleep paralysis almost every night, and, uh, I would be sexually assaulted in my sleep over and over again and, and wake up feeling so guilty, feeling so ashamed. Um, submitting my body as a living sacrifice to God for the holy and pleasing to God. And, um, I believed that because of the curses that were spoken over me, that this is just the consequences thereof, and I just needed to live like this. And I used to tell Jesus, "I'll be a mute for you. It's okay as long as I can serve you." And the Lord would comfort me.
[1:03:10] He would comfort me during that time. Like, he shared with me about the disciples and how they were arguing about who's the greatest, and Jesus is about to go to the cross. You know, he's gone through some things, too. Says in the Bible that we serve a Lord and Savior that has been in human form, and he has gone through things. So that comforted me a lot. But, uh, because of all of the supernatural things that I'd experienced and how dark it was, um, God really had to take me through a, a process, you know, um, for me to, to, to love, um, and to serve him.
[1:03:46] Um, you know. But, uh, yeah, through that, I, I just accepted it. I accepted I was going to have all of these consequences, um, for, for my sin. And, uh, I, I was, uh, very, very, very broken. Um, but in 2021, in the beginning of 2021, I was, uh, in the kitchen one, uh, evening, and a YouTube video popped up on my phone. Clicked on it. Moment I clicked on it, I clicked into a, a Zoom call And, uh, I was absolutely shocked.
[1:04:22] I was live on a panel of, like, six, seven other people, and all of a sudden I was asked to unmute, and the pastor called out and he said, "You." Called, said, "Karin, um, God wants to set you free today." Just like that. And I began to cry because I knew God is gonna do something. And then, um, he began to rebuke the demon to leave me, and I started to hyperventilate. Like, it felt like a demon was clutching to my chest, and I couldn't breathe.
[1:04:55] Uh, but as he declared the fire of God, my whole body was on fire, and he said, "In the name of Jesus, come out of her." And I was set free. I was set free in that moment. And, uh, no more sleep paralysis after that. Praise God. And, uh, the anxiety, all of the really oppressive things, like, I was delivered from that just like that. Like, God, um, it was in His heart to set me free from the consequences that I thought I needed to just accept and live with and be okay with, um, by His grace.
[1:05:32] And, uh, after that, I joined that church, got discipled there. It was an online church in the US, and I'm in South Africa, so time difference. And I joined their prayer team, and, uh, I started training in spiritual warfare, and I started learning how to take the Word and break off strongholds in the mind, and God was really, um, just, uh, uh, blessing me so much through this online ministry that was far away, um, while I was going to church and serving in, in my local church as well.
[1:06:08] And, uh, after that, after being discipled, uh, the pastor came to me and he declared a prophecy over my life, and he said, "The Lord wants to use you in deliverance." And, uh, I had, uh, because of all of the supernatural things I saw, I, I understood that people are in bondage because of Satan. And I just wanted them to be set free. Understood that, and it was on my heart, um, to, to for God to use me like that.
[1:06:43] And after that I started to train in deliverance. Um, and, uh, I joined the deliverance team. Uh, at the same time I was serving on their intercession team, and the pastor asked me to lead intercession. So I just became very, very busy. I became so busy for the Lord. I thought that this was, you know, I wanted to use my body to glorify God. And so, um, I was working full time. I'd be… I was a full-time mother.
[1:07:15] My son was now living with me full time, praise God. And, uh, then I was serving, uh, leading intercession and then deliverance. And because I'm in South Africa, it would look something like, uh, deliverance all night long from 7:00, 8:00 till the morning. Go to work, come back, prepare for intercession So, uh, I became very, very, very busy. Um, one… I'll give an example.
[1:07:47] Like, one, um, deliverance, you know, deliverance, the ministry of deliverance is wonderful. It is, um, very fast-paced. It's very, like, y- it takes a lot out of you physically and spiritually, um, w- uh, when you are counseling other people and praying for them. And the amount of warfare as well, of course, because you're challenging Satan's kingdom. You will experience warfare. And during this time, the Lord was teaching me how to overcome that warfare.
[1:08:19] Uh, but I- in that deliverance service, I was in a breakout room, and they would send people through, and it, it was hundreds of people. And this specific lady, there was a student observing while I was ministering deliverance to the people, and she wanted to be in the team. So, uh, this lady, she was from Africa. And she came through, and she had been unsuccessful in almost every area of her life, like marriage, having children, work.
[1:08:49] And, uh, through that we'd, you know, discerned that there were altars set up in her life through her ancestors that was, um, uh, keeping her witchcraft, um, upon her life. And so we dealt with the altars, and then I spoke the fire of God over her. And, um, suddenly the demon began to manifest. And it, what, what it was doing is it was taking off jewelry o- off of her, like in the spirit, like jewelry, headgear. It was hitting her.
[1:09:21] Um, it was on fire. But eventually she was set free. And just the look on her face, how she was praising Jesus, how light filled her eyes. Uh, she was set free, and she, uh, delivered testimonies after that. And so, I mean, I came out of that deliverance, uh, session just so happy, so energized. It was, you know, in the morning. I remember going to work on the bus. I didn't sleep much the night before, but I was so thankful.
[1:09:53] Say, "Oh, Lord, you're using me. I'm so thankful. This is amazing. I'm seeing people get set free. Wow, the power of God." You know? Um, so after that, after work, um, uh, uh, late afternoon, uh, I'm sitting with my Bible at my desk, and now I need to prepare to lead intercessions. I'd always prepare a word or whatever, and I was studying on the Tabernacle of Solomon. Uh, Solomon building the temple and the workers and so forth. And, um, I just heard a voice.
[1:10:25] So at this point I was tired. That energy from the morning, it had worn off. That energy, you know, I'm sitting, Anna. I just hear of God's voice and He says, "I miss you. Just I miss you." And I, I began to cry because I was tired. And I had been in the word every day to minister to other people and to prepare to lead intercession and to pray and to be used by God.
[1:10:57] But in that moment, I had not been with Jesus. And I was on the floor repenting and saying to Jesus, "I miss you too. I'm tired. What are we gonna do?" And, uh, so after that, I laid down my Isaac. I laid down deliverance. I felt like the Lord still wanted me to be in the intercession team. And after that, uh, the Lord moved powerfully in the intercession team, and God began to teach me about deliverance through intercession.
[1:11:32] And, uh, in Acts 12, uh, Peter is, uh, sent to prison by Herod, and he's chained on both sides. And there's two guards next to him. And, uh, there's no way that he can break free. But it says in Acts 12:12 that Mary, the mother of John, had gathered with other people at the house to pray. They were interceding for Peter. And what takes place in Acts 12 is that an angel comes, breaks the shackles off of Peter, and leads him out, uh, until he is at that very house.
[1:12:10] And when they open the door, they say, "We were praying for you." So Intercession is powerful when it comes to deliverance. And, uh, I saw groups of people be set free. Like, once we prayed for a conference, the Lord shared with me the word in Matthew that says He healed all that were sick and oppressed by the enemy. So as we began to declare this in the intercession meeting, the conference is taking place far away.
[1:12:41] The next day we received word multiple people were healed. That's when the Lord shared with me the power of intercession for groups, nations. You know, there is s- uh, intercession is, is, uh, is upon God's heart. Jesus says, it's in Hebrews, He said, "He forever liveth to make intercession for us." He could save to the uttermost, and He forever liveth to make intercession. So it's God's, Jesus' desire and His ability to save to the uttermost complete salvation, and He makes intercession.
[1:13:19] He's still making intercession for us every single day. So the Lord was teaching me Himself in the ministry of deliverance and, and all the, uh, dimensions of deliverance. But, uh, at the same time, uh, what had taken place personally is, uh, I had a dream, and in this dream I was on my knees, my son's face on the left, and the Lord's voice. And He was saying to me, uh, "Will you lay it all down?" And, uh, after that, uh, it wasn't long that my son needed to go to, uh, grade one to normal school.
[1:13:57] And his teacher called me in, and she said to me that, you know, "David, um, I encourage you to take David to get an analysis done at an educational psychologist because he is bright, uh, X, Y, Z. However, he's really… He's, he's not as developed as he should be. Uh, he's got a, a bit of a speech problem. Uh, his fine motor skills aren't there, and so, uh, I just really encourage you to take him." And so I did.
[1:14:29] I took him to, uh, an educational psychologist that did an eight-week analysis, and she came back with a report about 10 pages long, and she said to me that David's got autism. She diagnosed him with autism. She said that he is really far off, um, you know, he's, uh, away from the development that he should be. His fine motor skills are not developed. He's got a speech impediment. Um, listed a whole bunch of things, uh, and said that putting him in a normal school would be just really detrimental to him.
[1:15:04] She went as far as to say that, uh, she doesn't think that he'd ever be in a normal school. And so she, uh, suggested two special needs school to, to me, which I looked at, and I went home, and I sat with it. And then my aunt, uh, came to me and she said to me, "Isaiah 53, whose report are you going to believe? Are you gonna believe the educational psychologist report, or are you gonna believe what God has to say about your son?" And, uh, we went through the word.
[1:15:38] The word says, "You are more than a conqueror in Christ Jesus." It says that, "The plans that I have for you are plans to prosper you, not to harm you, to give you a hope and a future." So that I spoke o- over my son. He's got the mind of Christ. He's whole in Christ Jesus. And, uh, so yeah, I put him in a normal school. We went to a normal school. But, uh, within the first couple of months, that teacher called me in and, and sat me down with his report and said to me, "He's failing English.
[1:16:09] Uh, he's, um, not at the development that he should be. He's, um, failing some other subjects, too. He's got a problem with reading. His speech is, um, uh, he's got a bit of a speech problem. And so we really need to do something about this." And so I went home, uh, sat with it, and my aunt wonderfully came, and she said, "Karin, if you give it your all for 12 months, 12 months, and you trust God-" You're gonna have a, a, a, a miracle next year, by now.
[1:16:44] By now, next year. So I, at the time, had a lot of warfare with my work. Um, I couldn't be flexible. Uh, I ended up quitting, and I, I left the, the ministry as well, and, uh, be- began journey with my son. I put him into speech therapy. Uh, got him into reading school, and then at home spent every night, uh, crying, frustrated, uh, sometimes hugging, just pushing through o- on, on, on, um, his subjects.
[1:17:18] And, uh, within a month, the speech therapist, uh, told, uh, told me he no longer needs speech therapy. Uh, at night when he was asleep, I'd lay my hands on him and say, "In the name of Jesus, I bind you." And I used to declare… We used to take, um, we got pictures, uh, of, like of him, and then we would write scriptures on his identity and put it on the wall just to remind him of this is your identity in Christ. This is what God has to say about you. And, um, yeah.
[1:17:48] Um, so with that, uh, by September that year, he passed all of his subjects. Um, the next year he got an award for reading called Rockstar Reader, and he, he loves to read. Um, he did, uh, s- uh, public speaking. I… You know that, this year. So, um, he's playing piano. He's… God, God has healed him, um, and resurrected every area of his life. Like, every time that he speaks, and he loves to talk, it's a gift.
[1:18:21] But every time it's the resurrection power of Jesus speaking through him. It's like what the, what the enemy, you know, meant for evil, God turned around and, and used for good. And, and so praise God for, for His son, 'cause it's His son. Yeah. So, so amen for that. I just wanna say what an incredible, captivating story of how God can find us. You know, our, our lowest points and transform us, and only the Lord could do that.
[1:18:53] Only Jesus can do that. Um- Mm-hmm … and it's just amazing to hear. And in your son's life, you know, it's just incredible. So it's just been a, a pleasure and an honor to listen and just, you know- The root of, of my abuse, other than it being generational curses, is that I, I didn't, uh, know my identity in Christ. And, uh, I see that a lot every single day, that people do not, uh, know who they are in Jesus. You can only find your identity once you know Jesus as your Lord and Savior, and you come to understand that nobody can love you the way that he can.
[1:19:36] Uh, it doesn't belong, you know, in, in anybody else or anything else for that matter. And I was looking for it, you know, in its best, most perfect form, shala ad. Um, and I was looking for it in all the wrong places. And I, I c- I… It got to such a point that, um, it is only in Jesus that I found it. I didn't find it in any measure in anything else. So after that, um, 2023. Okay, so, so this, at this point, so the Lord had taught me deliverance, um, counseling, one-on-one deliverance that we're used to seeing, then through intercession.
[1:20:15] Then he came back into my family. Um, I, I live with my wonderful family. Like family relationships restored that, restored my son. And then he started to talk to me about the business arena, and he started teaching me how Satan, um, operates in business and how the Lord, uh, delivers, you know, through business Uh, and the systems that are set up. He actually took me through, like, all the kings in the Bible and how they would, um, trust in God, but then they would make a treaty with Egypt.
[1:20:51] Or they, you know, Ben-Hadad, Ahab made a treaty with Ben-Hadad and that led him to Jezebel. And so who you, uh, join yourself to in business, this is very, very important. Um, because if the enemy can't get you to, to, to sin, he will bring other people or opportunities or partnerships to do that. Um, and so the Bible says, obviously, what does life and death have in common? Anyway, I was a mess at this time. I, uh, had no discipline.
[1:21:22] I was disorganized. Uh, I knew that the gift of administration existed. Uh, and I knew that if God was gonna use me in the area of business that I, I needed to pray. And so I, I went on my knees and I said, "Lord, your word says that, um, if, uh, that if I desire the gifts, I can ask for them." And so I asked him for the gift of administration. And, uh, so right after that, I, I started working for this company, and the company was in the same town as, uh, my degree.
[1:21:57] And I'd gotten, by God's grace, a phone call from my university, and they'd made a mistake with my scholarship, and so they invited me to come back and finish my degree. So in 2023, I was able to go back and finish my degree. And, uh, I worked for this company, and I had so much warfare in this company. But I was there for two weeks and the, uh, executive administrator quit. And, uh, so my CEO called me in and he said, um, "Can you do your job?
[1:22:28] Um, you can do the admin. I'm, I'm, I know you can do it. And then can you hire two administrators and teach them as well?" And during this time, I was horrible. I was horrible at admin. I failed at this job. And my CEO, he actually called me incompetent, especially with Excel spreadsheets. He said that, uh, I'm completely incompetent and, and I make so many mistakes. Um, so I'd failed com- and I, I, I'd got no mark of, you know, incompetence in this area And, uh, so after that I finished my degree and I decided, okay, I really wanted to, you know, study MBA.
[1:23:10] I wanna study further in marketing and finance 'cause I believe that's the two areas that the Lord wanted me to step into, uh, concerning business. And, uh, so I, I applied for a scholarship at a prestigious university online, and I got it. And, uh, my son and I, we would've, uh, gone to the US to Boston. And I went to sleep the one Sunday, and, uh, I had a dream, and in the dream, my previous client, uh, I saw his profile picture, everything, and he invited me for an interview And when I woke up from the snap, I opened my phone.
[1:23:49] On LinkedIn there was a message for an interview. So I knew I had to go to this interview, and that's … When I went to the interview, uh, that's when I met you, Aaron, and I, I had to decide am I gonna take this job or am I gonna, you know. I remember the interview. You still s- you still said to me, "You, you, you've got all of this, um, but you can't do all of it." And I, I knew that. And so I went to prayer, and I had what I wanted, you know, MBA in the areas I wanted. I could've, you know, ticket for David and I at a better life.
[1:24:22] Uh, but I, I laid that down again, another Isaac, and, uh, took the job with you. And I remember the first two weeks we let, we had to le- let half the team go. I was praying so much. I mean, the person that gets hired first, gets last, gets fired first. But, uh, God preserved my job. And in that year I learned everything about marketing that no MBA could ever teach me. And, uh, Google Sheets became a thing.
[1:24:55] And, uh, I just wanted to share that because the year prior was, uh, told I incompetent, and I was. I was incompetent. But, um, God gave me the skills as in, in, uh, Exodus 31. I just wanna share this. It's, it's very powerful, uh, honestly. Um, Exodus 31, God speaks to Moses when they're about to build the tabernacle. And God says to Moses, "Moses, I've, I've chosen Bezalel, and I have filled him with my spirit in wisdom, in understanding, in knowledge, and in all manner of workmanship." So God had chosen Bezalel, filled him with his spirit, and then give, gave him wisdom, gave him understanding, gave him knowledge, and in all manner of workmanship.
[1:25:47] So it comes from God that, that, uh, the skills, the abilities, it comes from His spirit. And, uh, that's what the Lord was doing. He was, uh, just by His spirit, like, teaching me that, um, once I let go of everything that I think I need to do and build to be what he wants me to be, and just do it by His spirit, um, then, then He, He would do it. And so, so that letter, you, um, you got saved in 2025.
[1:26:20] Praise God. Praise God for that. And through, through, I mean, just this blessed, um- business and this work that we've been able to do. Like, my grandparents could, um, live comfortably, which I prayed for for so long, and I didn't think it was possible, and they deserve everything. And, and, uh, my aunt and uncle became missionaries, and they're going to the Philippines through Sent to the Nations to, to do God's work, uh, to work with orphans and to, to help children and to spread the gospel.
[1:26:54] And so today, um, I, I want to glorify Jesus and be a diadem of His glory and a vessel of honor, uh, and use, um, the systems that I've built, uh, to, to further the kingdom of God and to do it for God. And so yeah, that's what we do. We, we build systems for God so that He can… His kingdom can, can expand, and uh, people can be saved and set free. Absolutely. Hallelujah. Yeah.
[1:27:24] Incredible. And you're saying that y- you previously had an issue of Excel sheets. Well, I say you definitely got delivered from that because you're an absolute powerhouse when building building systems, building marketing, sales, uh, acquisition systems, what we've been doing over the last- Yeah you know, couple of years. I would have n- I would never have known- … put it that way. So, um, God has done a, a mighty work in your life, obviously, so . That's why I knew you would laugh.
[1:27:56] But it's true Yeah. I'd never worried a bit about Excel spreadsheets, yeah. That is, uh, that's hilarious. Um, and yeah, going f- like when you first joined, that was one of the hardest… You know, I was b- running companies for 12 years at that point. One of the hardest- Mm … weeks really. I know. Ha- having to let go f- I think five or six full-time staff that we'd, you know, we had, you know, come to love working with- Mm … and they was doing great work, and it was difficult. You know, it was a financial situation that we just had to- Yeah um, you know, navigate away from, and it was… We had no other choice, but it wasn't easy.
[1:28:30] And, uh, yeah, I didn't realize it was actually that week where you… Well, the week before you joined, so. Mm. Um, but, you know, through that, you know, seeing you just literally run through walls and, you know, build things from scratch and just, "Hey, this is the outcome, you know, you can do it." You know, helping out where I can. You know, it's been amazing to see you just take things up so easily and, you know, it's the grace of God, as you say, allowing you to just build for the kingdom. Because really that is- Amen … what we're here to do. And, you know, it pulled me out of, you know… 'Cause I've been se- I've been seeking for this my whole life as, you know, yes, money is great, you know.
[1:29:08] I always wanted to impact, you know, children and help children- Yeah … that have, that have been impoverished. But it was always kind of like I'm caught between two, two systems, you know? I'm caught between make money and then give back versus… And it n- never really clicked, but, you know, now we're building, uh, you know, helping ministries, helping Christian, uh, children's charities to grow the kingdom of God and help end suffering in as many children as we can. That is something which, um, I just know- Mm … I'm stepping into the perfect will of God because that's- Amen … you know, that's what I'm, I'm here to do.
[1:29:44] And, you know, thank you for your loyalty, your, you know, your, you know, nothing can, uh, stop me attitude to, to build because that's what it takes. And we're gonna go, uh, forth and, uh, you know, help save as many people as possible, um, through the ministries we support and obviously the children's charities that we, we support, too. So, yeah. Yeah. Amazing. Absolutely. Praise God for what He's done in your life. Yeah. And I'll, I'll also say this, like I had… I didn't even know you as a Christian un- until months after.
[1:30:16] I think I told you I was a, you know… I didn't e- I th- I think that's how it happened to, in, in January 2025, I got saved, but it was really a t- a 12, 18-month period leading up to that where I was really just going down every rabbit hole possible- And really off the back of 12 years of doing that. And, uh, the last kind of rabbit hole I wanted to, uh, you know, explore was Jesus and Christ. I saw some business leaders that I really respected. This is one of the… There's many things that happened, but one of the things was a business leader that I respected share about his faith, and he just started just- Mm bawling on camera.
[1:30:54] And I thought it was really interesting, you know, and just the way… And then the Holy Spirit, the Lord starts moving, and it's just like, it's almost like you're on a, an escalator towards your, your, your Kairos moment of salvation. Mm. And I was, you know, very s- very data-driven person, skeptical. I wanna know all the evidence. I wanna know absolutely- Mm … did Jesus live, did he die, and did he come back? Show me that first. Let me just go to the source. And, uh- Yeah … I kind of ignored everything else.
[1:31:24] That was, um… And just doing that was, was what led me to the truth that it is him. Mm. And it was there in front of me the whole time. And- Amen. … you know, and he, he's led us to this point here. So praise God. All glory to, to, to God and Jesus for the work he done in your life, your son's life, and the work he's doing through us with our, you know, with our work in helping ministries and children's charities. So praise God. Is there any advice you want, would like to share with anyone going through a situation that was similar to yours?
[1:31:59] Anything, you know, whether they've been saved or not, whether they've received the Lord into their heart, you know, if somebody's curious about Jesus and they're having, they're going through abuse, what would you tell them? Yeah. So the, the word that I, I wanna share is, um… It's in Luke, so let me just go to Luke 4. Uh, and, uh, it is also in Isaiah 61, and, uh, it's very, very powerful.
[1:32:31] So I think that it would, uh, it, the, you know, the word brings, uh, brings light. So it says here, let me get my… Okay. So Jesus, when Jesus is, uh, filled with the Spirit, and He goes and He's tempted, and then He comes out, and He goes to the synagogue. And in the synagogue they would, uh, take a scroll and they would read, and at this moment it was Isaiah 61. And so Jesus takes the scroll and He says, uh, "The Spirit of the Lord is upon me because He has anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor.
[1:33:12] He has sent me to heal the broken-hearted, to proclaim liberty to the captives, and recovery of sight to the blind. Uh, to set at liberty those who are oppressed, and to proclaim the acceptable year of the Lord." Uh, and, uh, He put the scroll down and He, and He put it away, and then afterwards, uh, people started to say, "Oh, is this not John of Nazareth? He can't have, you know, any… He, He doesn't, He doesn't possess any power." But they were still, uh, taken aback by the grace and the authority of His words.
[1:33:48] And, uh, and, uh, in this moment when Jesus encountered me, I was isolated from people that could save me. Uh, I was isolated. I was in such a broken place that I was in the literal pit of Hell, and it, Jesus is the one who came and saved me. And, uh, He pulled me up literally out of the pit of Hell. Uh, and, uh, today what I see is people are so, um, they, they don't believe They don't … They can say I'm a Christian or, or I'm serving God or … But, uh, when there are things in their lives that they are okay with, like for instance anxiety or depression or sickness or But Jesus, if you believe in Jesus, the Jesus that, that, uh, died on the cross for your sins, that took your shame upon himself, that received those lashes so that you can be healed.
[1:34:53] That Jesus who died at the cross and he was resurrected three days later, that Jesus. It says here that Jesus, the Spirit of the Lord is upon Him, and He came to proclaim liberty to the captives, the opening of the prison doors to those who are bound. Uh, I was watching a video yesterday. Over 33 million antidepressant subscriptions went out in the US alone in one year.
[1:35:23] Children at the age of three are being s- um, prescribed with these prescriptions. And, uh, it's a dr- and they are living drug-induced lives. Um, it's an open door to the demonic. Uh, and so today what I wanna share to anybody that is in bondage or in oppression is that if you trust in the Lord, if you believe. The Bible says believe and you will receive. Believe. Do you believe?
[1:35:54] Do you really believe? And then you take the Lord's hand. And you will be set free. He has come to set the oppressed free. He has come to open the, the prison doors to those who are bound, and there is no depth that He's not willing to reach to set His people free. So I would encourage each person, no matter where you find yourself, if you've been serving the Lord or you're in ministry, and on the outside it looks really good, but inside you know in your heart, uh, there are oppr- there's oppression there, or there are some things there that, that really does not line up with the Bible.
[1:36:36] Whose reports are you going to believe? Return to the Lord with all your heart. He's pleased with faith, nothing else. It says, "Without faith, you cannot please God." So believe. That is my encouragement today. That's powerful. Thank you for sharing that. Amazing. Please lead us in a prayer to close us out, Karin. Thank you, Holy Spirit. I thank you for this pr- for your presence right here right now, and I commit every single word spoken to you.
[1:37:09] Yes, Lord. I pray, uh, for every single person that is listening to this podcast or may ever, uh, even listen, I pray that you would even direct the right people to listen to this podcast, and I pray, Lord- Yes, Lord that you would encounter them like never before. Right now, I come against every demonic spirit that is keeping every person bound. I bind the spirit of witchcraft in the name of Jesus. Yes, Lord. I bind the spirit of infirmity- Thank you, Jesus … in the mighty name of Jesus.
[1:37:42] Yes, Lord. I bind every single, uh, demonic spirit that is causing sickness. Yes, Jesus. I curse the root of cancer- Yes, Jesus … in the mighty name of Jesus. Yes, Lord. I declare the fire of God upon every person from the top of their head to the soles of their feet. I thank you, Lord, that your word is sharper than any double-edged sword. It divides through soul and spirit, bone and marrow, right to the very thoughts and intents of the heart. Yes, Lord. I thank you that no stone is left unturned.
[1:38:13] I command every demon to leave, every demon of, from witchcraft, every demon of oppression, of depression, of anxiety, every demon of sickness. I command each and every one of you to leave right now in Jesus' mighty name, and I plead the blood of Jesus. I thank you, Holy Spirit, that as you enter every single body, mind, soul, and spirit, I thank you that everything that is not of you is exposed and that it leaves in Jesus' mighty name.
[1:38:47] I pray that you would fill your people with your love, Lord. That they would see you, Lord. I pray for eyes to be opened and ears to be attentive to your voice, Lord. Everything that has been keeping your people from hearing you clearly, I thank you that ears are open right now and that your people hear you clearly. For your word says, "My sheep hear my voice." And I thank you for that, Lord. I, I plead the blood of Jesus right now, and I thank you for your presence.
[1:39:22] I thank you for your peace. I thank you for your love, Lord. I thank you that with you all things are possible. Set your people free. I pray this in Jesus' name. Amen. Amen. It's a beautiful prayer. Thank you so much for sharing your story. It's absolutely captivating, and I know it's gonna bless many people. Thank you. God bless you. God bless you, too. Bye-bye.